While I wrote this post nine years ago, I’m still getting heartbreaking comments and emails from veteran teachers with good records and credentials who cannot find teaching positions though we’re still told there’s a teacher shortage.
When I first wrote this post in 2015, Jeb Bush was 62, Hillary Clinton was 67, Donald Trump was 69, and Bernie Sanders was 73. Now, many politicians, including the Presidential candidates, are close to 80 or beyond and still serving their country, and while some eyebrows are raised, it is accepted.
Here’s what I wrote in 2015, and it’s still relevant.
If these individuals were teaching in a public school, not famous politicians, what would you bet they’d still be working?
How many older teachers do you know who are still teaching? While there is much gnashing of teeth in the news about a teacher shortage, I don’t see any effort to bring elderly teachers back to the classroom. And by elderly, I’d start at age forty (no, I don’t think 40 is old, but they do!). Instead, they’d rather put someone in charge of a class who hasn’t earned credentials!
Older teachers face the “do not apply” signs wherever they go. For years, efforts have been underway to get rid of veteran teachers through faulty teaching evaluations, the elimination of tenure, school closures and outrageous early retirement plans. This phenomenon appears to be happening in many places.
In 2013, The Guardian’s anonymous “Secret Teacher” column titled “There’s an Insidious Prejudice Against Older Teachers” describes a veteran teacher’s unsettling fear that Teach First, which sounds eerily like England’s version of Teach for America, was being highlighted as the answer to education problems—older teachers were cast as culprits.
We often seem to be unfairly perceived as unmalleable or even as troublemakers, instead of as a rich asset. Over the last 18 months, a tsunami of change driven by fear seems to have invisibly swept over many schools and classrooms. Mistakes in some schools are not tolerated and have frightening repercussions. These days I am increasingly less able to put on my smiling mask and carry out my job confidently. And although I am far from overpaid, I am more expensive that a young, inexperienced teacher. With the onset of performance-related pay, I sense this is about to change dramatically.
Sound familiar?
Today’s education reformers don’t want teachers who cost more, or who speak their mind about untested curriculum changes, who bitch about Common Core State Standards, high-stakes testing or crummy student treatment. They sure don’t want an elementary teacher who demands recess! Or, a high school teacher who remembers free advanced classes that didn’t rely on AP as a convoluted way to make money for the College Board!
They don’t want teachers who will point to troubling outside corporate influence by those who are not teachers. In America, that would include people like Microsoft’s Bill Gates (59) or business entrepreneur Eli Broad (82).
Do you remember being taught by older teachers? I do. In first grade, my young teacher co-taught with a white-haired jolly old gal—a school grandmother type. She taught reading like a pro, and she had spunk! A story circulated that as she watched TV at home one night, she looked down to see a snake slithering across the floor. She waited until her TV program was over before she got up to catch it and throw it outside! Nothing would shake her…nothing! Children need that kind of rock to lean on. She read to us lovingly and showed funny movies on an old film projector that only she seemed to know how to fix. I will never forget her and always love her.
My kindergarten class was a half day, and while that teacher was not old then, she was older eleven years later when she called me on the phone–quite the surprise. She knew I was a majorette in the high school band and thinking about becoming a teacher. She had a little boy in her class with motor coordination problems. He wanted to be a drum major. She asked if I could come to the school a couple of afternoons during the week to march with the child around the cafeteria. I was honored she remembered me after all those years, and I developed much self-confidence working with that little boy. I will always…always love her too!
These teacher experiences create a bond between students that can last a lifetime. Teachers who choose teaching as a profession and who want to be there for students—always—are critical. Students deserve to experience good teachers of all ages. But older teachers have been targeted for years. Even if they hang in there, most are not respected as they deserve.
Their voices are ignored. Their valuable experience cast off. How often do they get to do original planning these days? How often do they have to put up with scripted, commercialized material foisted into their classrooms?
In some places, veteran teachers are leaving the profession. While that is sad, it is understandable. In other places older teachers are fighting for their right to teach and be appreciated. Here are some cases:
- Sheri G. Lederman, a highly regarded, 17 year veteran fourth grade educator, with a flawless record, is suing past education commissioner John King and the State of New York due to being rated “ineffective” because of her “value-added modeling” (VAM) ratings. Valerie Strauss of the Answer Sheet explains more detail about this here. It is a case highly watched by educators and parents across the country. VAM is being challenged in many places. One must question whether it is a tool to get rid of older teachers.
- Madeleyn Dimitracopolous, 72, who taught English at Flushing High School, also in New York, claimed to have been given unsatisfactory VAM ratings to force her into retirement. Judge Jack Weinstein, 92, threw out some of the claims but acknowledged a “crisis being played out in schools.” The case moves forward.
- In Denver, Cynthia Masters, 55, still loved teaching, especially in high-needs’ schools and in special education. One would think she would be a dream come true for a school district when you read about the so-called shortages in these areas. But in 2012, Masters was put on indefinite unpaid leave. Senate Bill 191, introduced by Michael Johnston, a Denver Democrat became a state law designed for “reduction in buildings” or RIB for short. Getting RIBed means that teachers like Cynthia could lose their jobs for a variety of reasons, including school closures. Here is a more detailed rundown of this method that includes evaluations as a part of the process too.
- In 2012, the NEA described several EEOC charges on behalf of teachers in Arizona, North Carolina, and Oklahoma. There have been many questionable early retirement plans pushed on older teachers, while providing “economic benefits to younger employees.” But remember. Many young teachers are from fast-track programs and see teaching as temporary. They will leave as soon as the job of their dreams comes along (often an education administration position).
Today’s teaching workforce is built upon the desire on the part of education reformers to have transitory teachers. Here today, gone tomorrow! That is the way to keep costs down and teachers aligned to curriculum changes and charter school control.
They will not build teachers who commit to students in a long-term career, who will strive to remain in teaching and do what is right and good to help students learn.
And when students get older they won’t have any teachers to go back to visit. The older teachers just won’t be there.
Great article! The quintessential example of ageism in education has to be the “Best and Brightest” bonus being given to teachers this year in Florida. To qualify you must be rated highly effective (unless you are new teacher who’s never been evaluated!) and must have proof of scoring in at least the 80th percentile on either SAT or ACT back when/if you took those tests in high school. This is clearly an incentive to bring in TFA stand-ins to more charter schools.
Based on this, does that mean that my doctor that didn’t make the 80% cut is incompetent or should do my brain surgery at bargain basement rates? Ridiculous about how SAT and ACT tests are used. Someone should sue.
How do you sue the government that has imposed their nonsense for so long now? Then they come up with wealthy DeVos to lead the way. Contribute to a campaign and presto – you got a job.
Age Discrimination is alive and well. It is certainly the most overlooked – after all who cares? That’s why they get such great bargains with the subbing crowd. I went to subbing (7) years ago because there are so few (if any) jobs for the ‘mature’ crowd and some of us must still work.
Today I make the same $100 a day (full day) with no benefits, no support, and the label “temp employee”. That actually comes out at a little over $14 an hour. I have college teaching experience (10 years as an adjunct – 3 years p/t in public school) including a Masters Degree and an expired Postgraduate Professional License (teaching) as of 2018. Why bother with renewing?
I made top grades on all the “required” courses for a license, but the only number they saw was my age.
The school will hire a fresh out of college kid to teach with absolutely no experience or even a license over an older person any day. I made a point of applying for five or six jobs (just to test the theory). They don’t even interview you.
Each time I eventually subbed for the people they hired which brought me to the conclusions previously mentioned. Now those young teachers are having babies and taking off from school which requires more subs.
It’s a no win.
I posted about this three years ago. I was a new grad at age 64, with a MAT and M.Ed (Ed Tech), and submitted 17 applications in NW WA. I didn’t receive a single interview. I eventually came to Alaska, where elders/seniors are respected. I love teaching here!
How interesting! I’m so happy for you, Dena! Thanks for letting us know!
One just never knows what Florida is going to do next with education. But this bonus really does seem like age discrimination. Thanks for pointing that out Amy, and your point is well-taken prof.
At least some teachers aren’t buying it.
http://www.tampabay.com/news/education/teachers/bonus-program-has-some-florida-teachers-telling-the-state-keep-your-money/2241561
This article is so true, i work in High Point NC and we have lost a number of great teachers due to age. Our new young principal has just recently received his doctorates and has been heard by a number of faculty member when giving a tour to new parents…”we have a number of veteran teachers here but i’m working on fixing that.”
We have lost one of the best art teachers in our county, a wonderful ESL teacher, EC teacher, a great and loved Kindergarten & 1st grade teacher within the past 5 years due to age and 3 out of the 5 were not ready to leave. All have been replaced with young applicants. Most turn around we have had in years. I’m worried i may be next on the list.
Perhaps if you capitalized the word “I” you would not have to worry as much. There are also a few grammatical errors.
I’m giving Cant Give the benefit of the doubt and assuming that he or she was typing on a phone. It’s exhausting to constantly hit the up arrow.
A little picky, no? When someone is has a problem….
Candance, put a lid on it.
KILL THE MESSENGER – forget the message Ms. Petty.
I experienced ageism when I tried to get into teaching as an older woman entering the teaching field.
I had gone back to school after raising my kids, earned my degree just prior to my 50th birthday, then went into a two-year teacher certification program, while still working full time.
About.a third of the students — mostly women — in that program were in their 20s-early 30s, a few in between, with the final third around my age. The majority of the youngest third got teaching positions soon after graduating/becoming certified, whereas very few of the older group — including me — were fortunate enough to be hired into full-tume teaching positions.
I substituted for more than two years, hoping I would somehow be able to get my foot in the door, but finally had to give up completely and go back to my former job that provided me with health coverage and benefits — critical for someone my age who also needed to plan for my retirement years ahead.
Just want you to know that a guy out here who experienced the same thing as you, and I’m now 67 with a Masters degree and have sent out 203 applications, and I had had one interview- have decided to return to being retired. One superintendent during an interview, asked me why a retired executive would want to be a teacher???? Unbelievable. I worry about our future as a nation, but it probably doesn’t matter. Peace.
I am a “retired” teacher. I was not ready to retire, but actually felt the age discrimination from the students (junior high). I had partner teachers who were in their 20’s/30’s and it was always clear to me from the get-go that I was the “old one”. I had been an elementary teacher for years, but wanted to work with older kids after twenty years of working with the younger ones. Now, at age 59, I am furthering my education, and hope to teach at the high school and junior college level. I would like to teach to students who
A)Want to be in school
B)Appreciate me for my ability to teach them what they want to learn
I have a lot of hope and I think that with perseverance, it is possible to find a situation that fits. I’ll let you know how it goes!
Good for YOU! Yes, let us know how it works out. I will be cheering you on! There is no reason teachers should be made to leave the profession so soon.
You are a fool for spending more money furthering your education. People over 50 are not wanted anywhere, even higher education. This is a horrendous societal problem that EVERYONE is ignoring. Older people are being shamed for wanting to work. Good luck; you’re going to need it!
Well, no one is a fool for wanting to further their education. I have to disagree with you there. But the key is to find the right school and not fall for any of the for-profit or bogus online programs that will gladly take your money and leave you in debt. But it is a terrible problem that not everyone is aware. Thanks, Jane. I see your points.
Sadly, it’s getting to where it is not just people at or over 50 dealing with age discrimination, I am seeing it happen to those at or near 40 now. My first teaching position came right when I turned 40 after finally deciding to pursue my dreams of teaching. After 2 years of stellar performance my principal called me into his office towards the end of the year and told me he “didn’t think I grew enough as a teacher and didn’t want to bring me back”…followed by the sentence “and I have your review here, but I’m not going to read it” despite me having some of the highest evaluation marks in a school of 200+ teachers, being nominated for Teacher of the Month several times, and won a peer award for “Most student-centered classroom.” But all that meant nothing to him because…
He was overheard the week prior telling one of his associate principals he wanted to get rid of all the teachers he felt “were too old to mold the way he wanted them to be.” 15 teachers were not invited back that year. He went on to lie to other principals I interviewed with for years about my performance, stating “I was a bad teacher and threw things at my students.” He got away with it because he worked his way into the back pocket of the district superintendent. He drove the school into the ground to where it is now ranked 1274 out of 1400 schools in my state, while he took a new job as Director of Human Resources at another district…where he can continue to discriminate against people trying to do what they wewre meant to do.
Now that I am nearing 50, I can’t even get interviews. I recently attended a job fair for a school district I had several connections and inroads with, and was told by one principal there that I would never get a classroom because I “was on the wrong side of 40.”
I’ve now given up getting back into a classroom after putting so much time and money into pursuing that dream, getting a Masters in Education to make me the best teacher I could be, and gone back into the private sector. I love what I am doing now, and am making a LOT more money than I did as a teacher…but it isn’t teaching. I would have given anything, literally ANYTHING to be able to have a classroom again because that is what I am hardwired to do.
But nooooo….we have to now live in a society that says someone who has a ton of experience at something and is an acknowledged expert in their field is not as valuable a resource to attain as someone who has zero life or work experience and is only looked at because they are younger. Shame on society and business…SHAME!!!
Thank you for sharing your story, Todd. I’m sorry you were driven out of teaching like so many. There’s an agenda…as I think you know.
And add to all this the fact that the districts will all have you sub your ass off without any contract offers… They use you to death and unless you’re connected, forget about it. But consider this: Do you really want to put up with tyrranical, control freak instructional coaches and bureaucratic principals who are ineffective and ultimately promote and graduate students who haven’t learned to read and write?
You’re not wrong. After I lost my classroom I spent 5 years as a substitute in over 10 local districts around me trying to get in good with them hoping that I would land a full-time gig with them.
Like you said…I got used to no end. Even in districts where I had a highly regarded reputation when a classroom came open that I was certified to teach, I still wouldn’t even be granted an interview despite the administration knowing full well I wanted to teach there and had been a sub there extensively.
But no, I have no desire now, or any desire then to work under tyrannical principals and instructional coaches who only thought their way was the ONLY way to do things, who refused to see or listen to new ideas despite how effective they had been evidenced in their effectiveness, or work for an organization that allowed a student as I once had to get moved up to the 9th grade while being diagnosed as having a KINDERGARTEN reading and writing level!
No one is a fool for wanting to further their education, but it’s a ‘fool’s game’ to think any opportunities are available in the school system. It’s simply a waste of time. . .
This culture is focused on simplistic YOUTH, where age seems to be a qualification for everything, including teaching.- they will not consider a mature person to teach in public schools – or anyplace for that matter. Sad but true, don’t waste your time or money.
It’s sickening to still have a good brain BETTER THAN WHEN WE WERE YOUNG and be send out to pasture.
Then the politicians want to cut off social security for older Americans too! It’s a no-win. Seems like they want us to die off – no jobs, no opportunities, no money to survive – no benefits.
It’s wrong and the Old, White Men make most of the rules. . .
We need to make the changes so education will thrive and provide our children with what they need to lead successful and happy lives.
Yes, my experience almost to a “t.” I work in a school district now, but in a clerical position while I watch youngsters, and not always very bright ones, get hired for teaching jobs right out of their credential program. People talk so much about what’s wrong with education, but nobody wants to tell the truth. The hiring process is flawed, and it’s a cult of youth these days. Just shameful.
I have taught for a total of 14 years between 1997 and the present (full time) Ive substituted most other years. I have lost my job twice due to budget issues/layoffs, and have continued applying. I have applied for jobs where the district claims there is a shortage of qualified candidates. I rarely even get a call back.
Now I sub for interns sometimes who ( to phrase it nicely) are very naive about their responisbilities. I’ve only had good to excellent evaluations, but cant seem to get a jobs in California during the so-called “shortage”. I dont know what the hell is going on, but I’m about to cash out STRS and do something else. If subbing/ and teaching for so many districts/years doesn’t show I have persistance, I dont know what does…..I also know many others more quaulified than me who are in this boat. Heck I have ex-students who are now teachers that said I inspired them. Now I sub for them once in a while at school sites. A nightmare on so-many levels. How will the inexperienced teachers fare with “test-scores”?
Good luck to everyone! Hope you find a better path than I did!
~ Age discrimination is alive and well. It’s everywhere! The public school system is most obvious of all. They will often “allow” an older person to substitute, but don’t waste your time applying for jobs – that is unless you’ve got a point to prove. After teaching at university level for ten years, I realized that would never go anywhere beyond adjunct status. No benefits – nothing. There are people who remain adjuncts forever. So I gave public schools a shot only because there was a p/t opening in Art. Came into the system with a MFA – started the certification process. – finished with top grades. Cut-backs came and art was the first to go. Eventually decided on subbing – now going into my 7th year and it has been an endurance test. Five times I applied for an art teacher opening – was never considered. I visited all the teachers eventually who did get those jobs and wasn’t surprised to see young women right out of school – no experience – no advanced degrees, and usually no license (pending, of course). As a sub, you have no rights, no benefits, no raise – and if anyone complains about you – you are guilty as charged and will never even get a hearing. Nothing! Sadly it’s a no-win, regardless of your education or abilities – age is all they see.
So many people echo what so many others are going through or have gone through…myself included.
I got into teaching very late in the game and was fortunate enough to get my first teaching gig when I was 41 because my principal saw my 20+ year experience in the real world as an asset in teaching World Geography. I loved what I did, loved my kids, my fellow teachers, the whole 9 yards. Then I found out how toxic my principal actually was.
Promoted a culture of “It’s my way or no way” where he would literally bully teachers in front of other teachers and students, declare someone to not be a team player for simply presenting an opinion different from his, and would absolutely use personal feelings in decisions to keep teachers on staff regardless of their evaluations. It was at the end of my 2nd year teaching that I heard he had planned to not renew me despite the fact that I had one of the highest evaluations in the school that year, which he told me to my face later on that he had no intention of even reading my evaluation.
He was then overheard by several teachers that he planned on getting rid of the teachers he felt were “too old” and would bring in teachers “he could mold the way he wanted”, meaning freeh out of school. When confronted about it, he didn’t even deny it, yet when he was taken before the school board for it, he denied it and it became a whole “he said/she said” scenario…and guess who won.
That was 5 years ago, and I have STILL not been able to get another classroom. I have substituted in 7 local districts non-stop in hopes of making a good name for myself (which I always do), but I never even get an interview for classrooms that I am told they need a good teacher for. Like others, I followed up in some of the schools I subbed in to see who they hired, and sure enough….20-year old kid with little to no actual work experience at all.
What is shocking more than anything is that I have actually had several principals flat out tell me to my face I am essentially, as one gentleman put it, “on the wrong side of 40 when it comes to teaching”. So here I am with a Masters in Education, exceptional ratings from teaching in my school, excellent references from my time substituting, and yet I can’t even be given a chance to teach because someone as old as my daughter is in the mix.
There has to be some way to create functional legislation to prevent age discrimination when it is obviously in practice as it is with teachers. Good, highly qualified and effective teachers are unjustly, unethically, unprofessionally, and illegally being forced out of professions we put our heart and soul into.
WOW! I feel your pain. What a slap in the face! In my district a sub with a degree makes $20 more (full day of subbing) than a person right out of high school. I hold three degrees and a Postgraduate Professional License (expired June 30, 2018). No point in renewing it. On July 1st 2018 – the state of VA announced that all license; hereafter, will be for 10 years. My license was for five years: I spend about $5000 (out of pocket) on all the required classes, test, etc. There was no reimbursement for any of it because I was teaching p/t initially and now subbing. A few years ago, I was subbing all day for 7th grade history.. We were talking about the importance of the tobacco crop in those early days of our country. I mentioned how differently we look at tobacco now and understand the dangers – I said, don’t smoke! The kids really wanted to have a conversation. We had a stimulating class and all went well – or so I thought. In a few days, I got a nasty letter from the administration that someone complained about what I said (apparently) and I would be banned from that school. In fact, I could be removed from the entire district, they warned. Naturally I furious and WANTED to discuss it, so I made an appointment. Never could get the details of the so-called problem, simply told that I was not qualified to council students. WHAT? They are so insulting and I might add IGNORANT too. We all ‘walk on eggs’ (I’m not good at doing that) because they hold the cards and we have no one on our side. If misery loves company – well it’s good to hear about your experience.
A big part of the problem is that the union gets the same amount of dues no matter who pays, or how much that person makes. The union can throw an older teacher under the bus, and the new teacher will pay the same dues. There is no incentive for unions to fight ageism. If they reduce pension liabilities by PARing older teachers and getting them to resign, the union gets leverage in negotiations.
In California, Nevada, Ohio, and Maryland they use a program called PAR to push out older teachers. The stats on PAR prove age discrimination, but the union won’t stop participating in it. Most districts won’t even release the stats and the teachers who have gotten ahold of stats have faced extreme retaliation.
http://withabrooklynaccent.blogspot.com/2014/06/getting-rid-of-bad-teachers.html
https://berkeleyschoolslaborcaucus.org/important-files
Celia,
I have had the exact same experience. I too got my degree later on in life, 42 (even beat breast cancer in between my studies!) Worked as a long-term sub for 4 years in 4 different schools. Somehow I’m “fantastic’, and interview very well and have ‘superb classroom management skills’, , yet don’t get hired as a permanent teacher. Always to have been beaten out by younger teachers with absolutely no experience.
I am now in a private school for 2 years in a permanent position but the pay is disgustingly low, but what choice do I have? I need a consistent paycheck even if it’s pittance. With still paying off my tuition, plus our two college age sons now, and another approaching HS it’s very disconcerting. I don’t even think my husband has enough cheer-leading to outlast this issue.
I completely empathize with you.
I’m experiencing this now, in that I am a 65-year-old new teacher grad. I also have a M.Ed in Instructional Design and Educational Technology. I’ve applied for 18 elementary teaching jobs in the PNW, yet I haven’t even received an interview. Every application asks for my birthdate.
Congratulations! How marvelous about being a new grad. It seems like this is a time when teachers especially in your area would be needed. Although this might not be the ideal time of year to apply since teachers are ensconced in their positions. Hopefully, come spring, those positions should become available as teachers move or whatever. You might offer to tutor or substitute to get your foot in the door and make some contacts. But hang in there! Let us know when you do get a position.
I have experienced this for 4 years now after moving from West Virginia to North Carolina at the of 66. It is blatant systemic age discrimination. It is a shame that the government does nothing about this.
Have you considered consulting an employment law/civil rights attorney? Is it legal/legit for the school to be asking your age? Good luck.
Nowhere is this ugly scenario more flagrantly played out than in Los Angeles. All the hype and public relations about last month’s strike can’t hide the fact that UTLA co-operates with the district in dismissing older teachers. From a high of about 43,000 teachers, about 5,000 have been dismissed and teachers continue to be abused and dismissed based on false charges.
This doesn’t surprise me one bit. For a long time now, major urban city districts have used “rubber rooms” to oust veteran teachers, minority teachers, political rascals who won’t keep their mouths shut about the districts (at both the local/school and central office level. Here’s a case I brought forth where this “rubber room” was employed.
http://issuu.com/luisgabrielaguilera/docs/luisaguileravschicagopublicschools
Gabriel’s Fire sounds like a fascinating book, Luis! Thank you. It is also my understanding that it is difficult to be published by University of Chicago Press! It is now on my “to read” list.
Rubber rooms–terrible. Have they gotten rid of them all by now?
It is good to see a teacher taking action–and how did you do with your case?
This is so important, and so little discussed.
Thank you for this!
Thank you, Gayle.
John Deasy at a Teach Plus presentation to an audience whose average age was about 25:
“It is ridiculous for anyone to think of teaching for more than 5 years before they move on to a real career.”
This quote–this man–is so ignorant, so damaging, and so heartless, but explains so much.
Well this is certainly true in Los Angeles because UTLA doesn’t protect dues payers. A young person should get out before they find this out the hard way. UTLA acts as a division of the school district and helps fire teachers.
A big part of the problem is that the union gets the same amount of dues no matter who pays, or how much that person makes. The union can throw an older teacher under the bus, and the new teacher will pay the same dues. There is no incentive for unions to fight ageism. If they reduce pension liabilities by PARing older teachers and getting them to resign, the union gets leverage in negotiations.
I am sure this is true in many places. However, where I teach, I feel that I am valued. I have taught for 47 years, and plan to keep on going as long as I can because it is my passion! I teach in a charter school in Windsor, Colorado. We have a wonderful administration, wonderful staff, parents, and children! I feel very, very blessed!
In 2016 I will be 72 and will have been a paid teacher for 50 years — only then will I call it a career; however, I have morphed in teaching the “Itty bitties” to university level, public, private, prison, agency — you name it, I have done it. Glad to know of another “getting up there” and keeps on answering the bell. What I like doing the best are secondary students and my graduate students. Age level I find challenging are middle grades. I think this is the level where we either excite students or we lose them — incessant testing is losing them.
Kaye, I am glad you are doing well at your charter school. Thanks for sharing.
And prof, I agree that the middle school level is critical. For a while, in the 80s, there seemed to be some real effort to focus on this age group. I’m not sure if that is still the case. But hang in there and keep on keeping on!
I love to hear of older teachers doing well!
I’ve been working in the same district since 1987 and am one of the oldest teachers in my middle school building. A few years ago our district hired a new superintendent who, according to a source in the district office, asked for a list of teachers over 50! He’s gone now, but that unnerved me! As for the importance of the middle level grades, I’ve been around long enough to see that testing and saving money are squeezing out the wonderful middle school philosophy that helps students succeed during this important developmental stage.
You better not ever leave your state or district – you’ll join the ranks of SNAP and the long term unemployed.
I am glad that Kaye is doing well but I do want to point out that Windsor is a very small town in very remote location! They probably hang on to all their teachers because not everyone wants to move out there.
I’m in the Boulder area and just got a teaching credential in secondary science and I’m in my fifties. I have a very recent degree in Biology and an older one in Earth Science. I have not been able to get a single interview. It doesn’t matter that I’ve received positive feedback as a substitute. Principles aren’t even allowed to interview me if HR doesn’t send my application to them.
Thank you. I think that makes much sense, and I am sorry that a person with your excellent credentials doesn’t get a chance. It is the student’s loss too. Keep trying.
I moved last year from MA to San Diego. I am a career changer, turning 50 in Nov. I have a Masters in Special Ed and taught a fourth grade inclusion class for five years. My last year, my students AVERAGED 83% growth on state testing with 40% identified with learning disabilities. The super loves me. I have great references. I have subbed all this year. Teachers love having me sub for them. I get comments like “you are a natural” “my kids are best behaved with you” and “the students love you.” I have taught Common Core. I was Rookie Teacher of the Year in 2012. I have been rejected by seven districts. My interviews were stellar. I can prove my value and CA teachers value me. I can’t get hired. I am devastated. This is my dream job and I am GREAT at it. I am dedicated. No one will hire me. No one will give me any feedback on how to improve my chances. I can’t afford to chase this dream much longer. I just want to help kids to learn
I am sorry, Anon. Hang in there. Many of us have been there. If you are flexible try to find a district with job openings and where you can match your skills and experience to the vacant teacher positions. It is difficult, but hopefully, you will find the right situation soon!
It sounds as though districts are truly missing out! I found that the educational hiring fairs can be a way in the door, as if you are in line early enough, the interviews are held right there, with many districts represented in one room. Some folks can get a recommendation from the interviewer, or at the very least, you get a chance to utilize the fact that you were already interviewed on your applications…I know you have probably tried this, but –just in case!! Best of Luck!
I have tried hiring fairs and I suspect other older teachers have too. I’m up-to-date and tech savvy so I do know about these things. The point that I can’t get past is the detailed application where they can see just how much I actually cost and how old I am. Doesn’t matter how great an interview I do.
Please come to Oregon, we need you!
I feel your pain. I worked several part-time support jobs in several districts over the past few years. I always received stellar praise and my groups always showed improvement in their test scores. It doesn’t matter. The districts would rather hire young, “energetic” people and pass over older candidates. Ask me how energetic I really am, as my husband and I both completed our first half marathon in November and we are not showing any signs of slowing down!
Catherine,
I was in just about the same situation as you. At 47, I’m not slowing down either, yet they see us mature teachers and somehow think we can’t keep up. I can run circles around these younger teachers AND keep calm control over the classroom.
I couldn’t get into public school, I tried for 4 years as a long-term sub, but got beat out by younger teachers (only to find out many lasted one year and got pink slipped). I’m in a private school now, getting paid very, very low, but it’s all I have right now.
Hang in there!
You are very lucky.
In Fall River, Massachusetts, we give schools where age discrimination is rampant the lovely label of, “Turnaround School”. Doesn’t that sound a lot better than, “Age Discrimination School”?
Yes, I am familiar with that term. We have those schools where I live too. They are used to bounce everyone, including credentialed professionals out based solely on test scores! But you are exactly right, Mike. They could call them Age Discrimination Schools!
In Denver it is “Innovation Schools…”
Wow. . . What is up with this? Wouldn’t administrators want honest people who can help the students learn v the malleable 25 year old, inexperienced yes person??
I still know more about reading and what books students will read with gusto than any young teacher today. I bet they wouldn’t call me. What they don’t realize by not hiring us is that the students are losing because of it.
I agree, Charmaine! Every new year gives teachers new ideas and information about what works (and doesn’t work) with students. Certainly, new teachers who are career bound bring fresh ideas too, but most teachers continue to grow and learn as they teach. Thank you!
and as a teacher entering year 40 and of early retirement SS age — I also know of many younger teachers, who having done their 30 years and achieved full retirement benefits from the school system are leaving as fast as they can given how the profession and they have been attacked from all sides, demeaned, devalued, and disrespected at every turn.
Yes, the states are stacking the deck against old teachers for years now.
Sadly, of late they are stacking the deck against ALL teachers.
You bring up an interesting point that I am quite concerned about, Doug. That is the “disruption” notion relating to technology. I think the ultimate goal involves online schooling. Thanks.
> I think the ultimate goal involves online schooling.
You nailed it.
It’s bad enough being a teacher for 20 or so years and getting pushed out. However, very few teachers these days, let alone public employees in general, work in one job for that long. Try being a mid-career changer and getting illegally dumped by a school district after getting five years in and trying to pick up the pieces years later. It is much, much worse, especially when there is no spouse to cushion the economic blow.
That’s tough, and I am sorry. Some politicians think it is great to have a whole bunch of jobs! Right. I hope something comes through for you. Take a look at the private schools in your area. Sometimes private schools are eager to hire real teachers even though the pay may not be as good. Still it is a position. Good luck. Let us know how you make out.
I am currently working in classified work, which while paying peanuts, is more steady than substituting. It is taking forever to get my Oregon license here because of TSPC’s open hostility to out-of-state teachers.
For older teachers illegally dumped by school districts, the problem is much worse because of the blackballing questions asked by most school districts in the country designed to weed teachers out. Years ago, when few administrators fired teachers unless those teachers merited it because they were a danger to students, the questions had some validity. Nowadays, answer “yes” to any of those questions, and you never make the cut for an interview. You can be like me and be absolutely NOT at fault for being fired. Doesn’t matter. There are some districts, however, that don’t ask those questions except those that pertain to felonies and serious ethical breaches, because the dumping of teachers is so rampant in this country. The blackballing questions really need to be illegal. So too the “do not rehire” designations by school districts, which are even bigger killers to teachers’ careers.
I have a contact at Oregon TSPC I would be willing to share with you if you need a little assistance. You don’t have to wait days for a return call or email. She is pleasant and explains EVERYTHING!
At my previous school (I retired in June) the principal called some older teachers dinosaurs to their faces. Cannot imagine what she said behind our backs!
The same thing happened at my school…and I am one of the dinosaurs to whom she was referring. Sadly, I too will be retiring this year , in part due to administration’s lack of concern and action for seriously troubling issues with students that veteran teachers pleaded for help with. We “dinosaurs” would gladly have helped if just asked by administration. Alas, the decision to move the teachers who had the nerve to speak up was the only solution that was deemed feasible…
That principal was terribly unprofessional! They should not be in a leadership role!
Some of this has to do with the salary structure that collective bargaining has helped to create, don’t you think? By assuring that experienced teachers must receive higher salaries, union contracts create incentives for local districts to seek out younger teachers, who are cheaper, more malleable, and less likely to make a fuss about BS administrative initiatives.
And shouldn’t more experienced teachers be paid more, Mike? In the past that would have included additional education too in the form of advanced degrees. Most teachers are being discouraged not to go back to school too.
Look, even at the high end teachers don’t make that much money for what they do. A small step increase each year is not a big deal. Principals no doubt do go for the cheaper teacher, but older teachers should not have to fight for the right to maintain their jobs if they are doing well. And test scores should not be used to displace them.
I am an older teacher and I have to say, some of these younger administrators trying to force me out and make me feel bad about loving my job are idiots. The unions are worthless but I have a private attorney ready to pounce for a percentage cut of what we would take. If life gives you a-holes, you got to use a-hole removers.
I would add from personal experience that unions have been less than helpful in protecting their members. My union rep stuck his chest out and said that he’d accompany me to the federal equal rights office. What he knew, of course, was that the law is written by the powerful. “Proof” of age discrimination must have occurred in a window of time (which moves forward every day) shorter than 1 year. Consequently, when the principal arbitrarily and capriciously changed your schedule to your disadvantage last year, when he did the same thing this year, last year’s screwing doesn’t count as evidence. So it’s really hard to make the case, because the admin knows this, too; they “schedule” the screwing accordingly.
I understand this completely, Richard, and I think it is why many teachers don’t like the unions. Something similar to what you described happened to me twice in my teaching career. A good union should stand by its teachers. But unions today are caving on a lot of issues broad and specific.
Despite this, unions have done much for workers’ rights in this country and without them I don’t know where teachers would be. I think the leadership needs to speak out more on the issues that affect students. Right now, they should address Common Core for example–or Teach for America.
And they should work harder on grievance issues so individual teachers get the support they need.
Thank you!.
The practice of eliminating teachers based on age (salary) is rampant in Seattle Public Schools. After 20+ years of glowing evaluations and positive feedback from parents and students I was suddenly rated “needs improvement” by a principal that had never taught a day in his life. At first I thought that if I did everything he said I would come out the other end. I did not realize that I had been sucked into a vortex that would leave me battered, bruised, marginalized and long term unemployed.
I repeatedly asked for 3-4 measurable goals for my “improvement”.. I was never given these goals as that, I learned, was not part of the game. Instead I was rated poorly for “problems” that were listed in four page eight point type such as, did not turn all the light on in classroom immediately after using projector, spent 11 minutes of class time on discussion, worked with one student for five minutes, gave the class seven minutes to read an article – with the comment that “most” students should be able to read it in five minutes. As a veteran teacher I was always assigned the most challenged students- those with low English skills, social and emotional problems and behavior disorders. I did not mind this as I could teach multiple levels of learners in the same class at the same time.
The processes of demeaning, demoralizing and disenfranchising me went on for two years. The upper level management supported the actions of the principal. I was replaced by a 20 something. I have not been able to find employment for over two years as I have no references.
C.J., I emailed you. If you are on FB I might be able to connect you with some folks in your area for moral support anyway. As you can see here, you are not alone. Many similar comments have been made the last two days on social media in regard to this post. Take care. Sorry for the name mix-up.
I am also a causality of Seattle Public Schools and- horrible union representation. There is so much to say- to the right people. And people who can help are sadly hard to find. The experience of being a top-of-the-pay-scale special education teacher there was so surreal and traumatic, unless one’s been through the wringer, it’s hard to imagine exactly how abusive the system is. I’ve learned more about school politics in the last two years than I did in the prior 18… Now, at age 57, with amazing written references from both parents and colleagues, I’ve gone to repeat/callback interviews for positions at independent schools. For all the wonderful, in depth, connected interviews I’ve had lately, the new normal is to not even get a “thank you but we chose someone else” response. It’s all so not righteous and depressing…
I’m so sorry Thulerose. Of course, you know I don’t think the system should work that way and older teachers should be respected and valued for their experience. I hope it turns around for you soon. Keep us posted.
CJ–you could very well have described my own experience to a tee. You are dead on about what the process does to a person–demeaning, demoralizing, and disenfranchising.
I had 14 years in as a high school teacher. I was a second-career teacher, coming to education after a decade in healthcare finance. My former district took advantage of a new eval system and change in evaluators due to a retirement to shift the goal posts on me without my knowledge. I was up against an evaluation system that had been weaponized, and given “goals” that were subjective at best, and received “support” in meeting only to the letter of the law. When I started having anxiety attacks in front of my students, I knew I was time to get out.
I walked away almost a year ago. Since then I have tried to find a post at another school to no avail. No less than 100 districts had my resume, but all I got back was crickets. Was my former district blackballing me? Maybe–I wouldn’t put it past them. More likely I think I was eliminated out of hand because of my years of service. I even added language to my cover letters saying that I was flexible on starting pay. But still nothing.
It is TRAGIC that the system is rigged to devalue the members that have the most experience and perspective to offer.
I was a School Counselor, with L.C.S.W., P.P.S.C., and a multisubject teaching credential. I was told I was not highly qualified and run out at 59 after 24 yrs in the same district. In California, school counselors are paid on same scale as teachers (although not all districts have elementary counselors and some that do, pay them on the classified/para scale ~Master’s level counselors!).
The privatization and corporatization of the Public Education arena is following the same course as that of the prison system. Suck the money out and break the system down. We are dismantling Special Education as we sit here! The language is even changing to make the public think everything is okay. ” Specials “and “specialists” are those who teach Art, Music and Dance. Specialists are not Counselors, School Psychologists, or Special Education Teachers as they have been for at least the 36 years that I have been a Professional Social Worker. They are taking away the protections that were fought for, of the Special Education special needs students. It’s all about money, never about the kids.
In our school the administration joined with the teachers union to sort of purge the ranks of older teachers under color of an easily retirement incentive coordinated with Medicare in return for a better deal for younger remaining teachers…..by popular vote of course.
Age by itself is a poor reason not to hire an older person….and in many cases a new hire of an older person especially in a system with a defined benefit pension plan is FAR less expensive , in some cases it’s like 4:: 1 cheaper and with pension contributions sometimes in 20 % range for employer it is no laughing matter !
And in some situations the costs to cover employees of child bearing ages are far higher than costs of employees say 50-70,.
But as a legal matter, age discrimination is not an easy case to make and to some degree older workers especially in state operated education systems are relagated to being very poorly unprotected under ADEA …..for an administrator,to make a series of negative comments about white male or black female,academic workers and then lay them off can be super,expensive to cure for district …but to make negative comments about older workers is treated like a big joke
At age 51, I earned my M.A. at a prestigious private college in northeast Ohio and completed the alternative certification requirements to become a certified English teacher in Ohio. The year was 2011. I’ve had several interviews, both with private and public high schools, and was told on two occasions that I had been a “finalist” (one of two or three candidates) for the job, but was not chosen. I know for a fact that a young female alum received one of these jobs, and now know that we older “candidates” are often called to interview simply to cover potential allegations of age discrimination. Though I was initially angered by this realization, I am happy now that I am aware of the “big picture,” (e.g., the truth) that schools base their hiring on age and expenditure of salary instead of a candidate’s education and qualification for the job.
In 2013, I received a call out of the blue from a high school located 10 minutes from my house. I ended up being hired to teach English to their at-risk students, and received a generous contract. Finally!
It is paradoxical that those of us who care most deeply for the students’ education and who are among the most devoted (and able) are summarily discarded as viable candidates due to misplaced conceptions/assumptions/generalizations based solely on our chronological age.
Congratulations! That is indeed good news!
The LORD woke me up to put in for my absence and look into TEACHER DISCRIMINATION and ‘WALA’ I haven’t been imagining ALL the mistreatment I’ve been receiving from the principal that came and eliminated over 90% of teachers by cruel and unusual punishment! I speak from experience to me on many occasions but despite my efforts to try to transfer she has not allowed it, I’m told because of my bilingual abilities, being there is a shortage in our area. We’ve never been a district in our state that receives a stipend for it. Smart teachers, this has been one of the hardest jobs I have ever had and I even worked labor in fields from elementary age to high school. Concrete with my dad’s business and law enforcement for 12 years. Among other jobs as a single mom trying to make a better life for my son who as an educator I now see how he was tossed out because the system takes advantage of those that don’t understand it. But that’s another story. I just know that my principal duly made it known from the beginning of her placement at the campus I’ve been at 19 years that I was old. No smile. When she first came to our school, I apologized her about not volunteering for extra duties, due to an illness my dr pointed out due to stress. Hmm.. She told me in front of our AP that if she was sick and couldn’t do her job that she would quit. Since then she has developed severe health issues herself but is still there. Since I guess she is a 34 year veteran and a single mom trying to leave a name for herself. This principal is well known for her tactics to make every school a success one and has been allowed to do so, in spite of numerous complaints to district. Kudos for her but at the expense of pushing Great teachers out and bullying others around! I hear there’s bonuses for them. Big ones. So I end in saying I love teaching but I can’t have laughs with my kids because she pops in while walking by and asks “What’s So Funny!” No smile. I’m just trying to get to my time of retirement but as you see by this day my illness is making me look bad. No compassion whatsoever! Really. GOD BLESS ALL TEACHERS! Good bosses, districts or not! LOOKS LIKE SOME OF OUR REWARDS WILL BE IN HEAVEN!
I have been a teacher for 20 years. I have been trying for 3 years to get a job in Denton and Frisco, Texas area. I have been substitute teaching and even doing long term sub jobs. I had several interviews and have been told I was number 2 and wasn’t chosen. I have excellent references. If I don’t get a job this fall I am doing a different career. It is extremely hard to get a job and I have to face reality
That’s outrageous! It always infuriates me to hear of well-qualified teachers who do not get employed during a so-called teacher shortage. You are also not the only one. Take care and let us know how you make out. I will keep my fingers crossed.
I agree that age should not be a determining factor in how likely you are to get a job as a teacher. Neither should gender, sexual orientation, physicial featurea, or other things that don’t affect who you are as a person. Older teachers can be just as good as young ones. Male teachers can be just as good as female teachers.
Maybe part of the reason why they prefer younger teachers over older ones is because they want people who have more energy and stamina. Energy and stamina are both very important, especially if you are teaching younger children. For middle and high schools (and maybe even late elementary school classrooms), maybe part of the reason they prefer younger teachers is because they want people who understand more about what their students are going through. If it has been several years since you were an adolescent (or went through puberty), you probably don’t remember as much about what it was like for you, and you may not understand as much about what your middle or high school students are going through.
But it’s still not acceptable to discriminate against someone based on their age, gender, sexual orientation, or physical features. It should be more about how they treat their students. Are they too rigid? Too laid back? Too goofy? Too serious? Just right?
Your assumption that younger teachers will have more energy and stamina than older teachers is just the sort of unconscious age-discrimination that is so prevalent!
Are you planning to retire at 40? Because that’s when age discrimination starts.
Teaching isn’t like playing football where you really do have to retire at a younger age. Older teachers know what they are doing and do it efficiently.
I’m not saying that I think ALL younger teachers have more energy and stamina than ALL older teachers. I’m saying that maybe the reason younger teachers are more likely to get jobs than older teachers is because the school administrators think that is the case. I don’t think that is true for all teachers.
Go back and look at what you actually said. Do you see how what you said actually assumed that older teachers have less energy etc? As a science teacher, I am constantly working with students to say exactly what they mean and only what they mean.
Try this instead: “Maybe part of the reason why they prefer younger teachers over older ones is because they assume that younger teachers will have more energy and stamina.” See how that signals to the reader that you do not necessarily agree with the administrators?
Also your assumption that someone who is older has forgotten what it’s like to be a teenager is another example of unconscious stereotyping about age which I addressed in another comment below.
Here it is again.
“And as to your assumption that older teachers will have less empathy and/or have forgotten what it is like to have been a teenager… Well all I can say is that is also a stereotype.
Simply to have been a teenager recently does not guarantee a better understanding of all teenagers, especially when those other teenagers might have had a completely different socioeconomic or life experience than your own!
I think that older teachers can have more empathy and a deeper perspective because they have had exposure to many students’ experiences not just their own.”
I know you mean well but you do seem to have some un-interrogated stereotypes about older teachers/adults.
Yes, that’s what I meant. Maybe the school administrators think that. I most certainly don’t think that. I didn’t mean exactly what I said. I wish I could find a way to edit what I wrote, but I can’t seem to find where it says edit.
Thanks Leanne,
I’m sorry I came down so hard. I just get these comments almost everyday, even to my face. Because I am an energetic outside-the-box teacher and don’t act like the old fogey of their stereotypes, people forget that I belong to the group they are dissing!
The problem is that I can’t even get a job interview because my age is the first thing that district HR departments look at.
Right now I’m doing a web dev bootcamp so perhaps I can avoid the whole age discrimination situation because I don’t need to put dates on my resume for those sorts of jobs. It’s a pity because I love teaching.
Anyway thanks for being willing to listen. 🙂
I just made a mistake. We all make mistakes. I’m sorry if I offended you. I didn’t mean I think older teachers have less energy, or don’t understand as much about what it’s like to be a teen or preteen.
Leanne, It is pretty common knowledge that veteran teachers are discriminated against due to the additional pay they get every year. Which isn’t usually that much. And you are right about efficiency. I left teaching much more efficient than when I started. I knew more and was much more organized. Thank you for commenting.
And as to your assumption that older teachers will have less empathy and/or have forgotten what it is like to have been a teenager… Well all I can say is that is also a stereotype.
Simply to have been a teenager recently does not guarantee a better understanding of all teenagers, especially when those other teenagers might have had a completely different socioeconomic or life experience than your own!
I think that older teachers can have more empathy and a deeper perspective because they have had exposure to many students’ experiences not just their own.
You know how many teachers (maybe even you, I’m not sure) don’t like it when students or parents/guardians give excuses? Well, I thought it sounded like you were doing just that (giving an excuse) when you said, “I just get these comments almost every day, even to my face. Because I am an energetic outside-the-box teacher and don’t act like the old fogey of their stereotypes, people forget that I belong to the group they are dissing!” Was that (giving excuses) your intention? I am not trying to accuse you of anything, I’m just curious. I have Asperger Syndrome (milder Autism, now just called Autism Spectrum Disorders), and a lot of people on the Autism Spectrum have difficulty understanding the “grey areas” when it comes to rules and codes of behavior.
Total BS answer of “ Energy and stamina are both very important, especially if you are teaching younger children.”
I ran 2 10ks in a week last spring placing in the top 3rd of my age group at 52. No medications, no health issues.
It’s AGEISM. It’s the budget. The system is gutted. An uneducated population won’t question the dictator.
I am a 58 year old math teacher, with 15 years teaching experience in HS, though this was in French. I spent a few years getting math certification expecting this would get me job security– the French program was budget eliminated at my old school. Now, with new student debts, I haven’t found a job after a year searching, maybe 6 interviews for 60 applications, and one half year leave replacement job. I never imagined I was destroying my life by getting math certification. I am numbwith anxiety. I don’t know what to do. I never imagined my age and qualifications would keep me from work.
I am so sorry. It bewilders me when teachers with great qualifications as you, in math no less, are not hired on the spot. Teacher shortage? Really? My guess is, you have a lot of years of experience and are up higher on the pay scale.
You might try private or parochial schools. Pay is usually less than public schools but it will be better than being unemployed. And you may be surprised. I have found that private schools especially can’t wait to hire a certified teacher.
You can search for a school district elsewhere and move if they need a math teacher bad enough.
You might also look at industry or some other area aside from schools. Good luck. And know you are not alone.
I am indeed applying for private and parochial jobs. I also plan to see if I can find a lawyer to bring a statistically supported class action age discrimination suit, and to see if I can interest a national newspaper in this situation? Do you know if this has been tried? Any advice?
I am watching multiple math teaching jobs be ready advertised months after I submitted a resume still active for the school with applitrak. It is clear I am not in the running, not despite but because I have a doctorate and experience of 13 years.
I would definitely join in a class action law suit. My sister is a demographer and might have some insight into what could be done. 🙂
Maybe part of the reason younger people are more likely to get jobs as teachers than older people because the school administrators think younger teachers have more energy and stamina than older teachers.
Or maybe for middle and high schools, it’s because they think younger teachers will understand more about what it’s like to be a teenager or tween than older teachers, because it hasn’t been as long since they were teenagers themselves.
Still, I don’t think it’s right to decide not to hire someone just based on age.
“Maybe part of the reason younger people are more likely to get jobs as teachers than older people because the school administrators think younger teachers have more energy and stamina than older teachers.”
Complete fallacy.
Younger teachers get the jobs over those with age, wisdom, and experience for two reasons, and two reasons alone: Age, and Money.
Districts don’t want to pay someone more because they have years or decades of experience when coming into their school district, and despite how many claims that they want their teacher to demonstrate a habit and mentality of “lifelong learning and improvement” by attaining advanced degrees…they don’t want to pay the extra stipends for those that get a Masters or Doctorate either.
I got my first classroom the year I turned 40, after having spent 20 years in the corporate world as a trainer, instructional designer and curriculum developer. It was what I did and how I was wired. I chose to go into teaching because I felt a pull to do so…not because I was after a higher salary because believe me, I took a pay cut doing so. I had a principal that openly said he valued his teachers, and especially those that had experience in life outside a classroom so that they could have the real-world perspective to prepare the kids for in their life after school. But secretly…he wanted nothing but young kids fresh out of college to “mold as he wanted” as he later admitted, despite also admitting that the system is unfair and often times teacher that could be the best at what they did were often pushed out of their classrooms in the first few years because of unethical administrators.
And I was one of those victims. Blackmailed into resigning my classroom despite the highest teacher review in my school of 200 teachers that year over another teacher whose review should have had her walked out of the school because she was 23, Hispanic and pregnant (it was a high population of Hispanic students school. ).
I spent 4 years trying to get another classroom to no avail. My review that I carried with me, along with my life in educational settings and a Masters in Curriculum & Education meant nothing when they called my former principal for a reference and he blatantly lied about me. Then this past June at a job fair, a principal flat-out told me to my face that I would not get a classroom again because I was “on the wrong side of 40.” So I finally gave up on teaching and went back into the corporate world, and am now a Technical Writer for the American Heart Association where what I know and can contribute matters not just to my team, but to the many people that my team’s work affects. And I could not be happier.
“Or, a high school teacher who remembers free advanced classes that didn’t rely on AP as a convoluted way to make money for the College Board!”
People look at me like I am crazy when I bring up this point; that teachers are quite capable of developing honors level, challenging curriculum that is not out of the CB playbook.
http://truthinamericaneducation.com/uncategorized/the-back-door/
This article is so true. I retired in 2005 after 30 years. The last 10 I was accused of being a dinosaur and a pain. I guess I was when I fought to have full class periods with no interruptions from the intercom, time out for non-essential activities, time out to make AP and Honor students read just because we had some low readers in other classes, etc,etc, etc. I fought for my students’ education. Even though my AP pass rate was great, I was encouraged to change curriculum that leads to that course’s necessary skills…water classes down so more students can apply( money involved of course). Materials that I had made were removed from use. I loved teaching, miss it a lot. But I could no longer teach when I knew I was not giving my students what they would need in the future. I still am in contact with many of my former students: lawyers, doctors, CPAs,finanical advisors, engineers, NASA employees……I am so proud of them all. Knowing I was a small part of their future is worth its weight in gold! Teachers make the workers of tomorrow….Remember that!
Thank you very much, Nancy, for publishing this article. I have been working to get the Seattle Education Association, the WEA and the NEA to actually take a stand against age discrimination in education for about seven years now. It’s a hard row to hoe. Leadership stays insulated — a bit of power allows people to escape the effects of targeting themselves. I am hoping that the worm is turning. At the WEA RA last April, I wrote, an amendment to the WEA’s continuing resolution on diversity that passed. It now states that the WEA believes that age diversity is an integral component of workplace diversity. At the NEA RA last July, delegates passed NBI 58, directing the NEA to publicize what is happening to older teachers, and to advocate for the support and retention of teachers of experience. I’m hoping that a lot of people will join me I holding the association’s feet to the fire on this one. I also feel that it is time to start up Gray Panthers chapters again. There is a national network, but no central office any more. We need band together with people of all ages to fight rampant age discrimination. It’s not just in education. http://ra.nea.org/business-item/2016-nbi-058/
I just wrote the WEA about this issue, not knowing of your work from several years ago.
I have retired after 32 years of teaching due to health issues caused by the stress of teaching. I have degrees in math and a masters in physical science. I have been math department chair in two different districts. I have been team leader and sponsor to several clubs over the years of my teaching. I have taught under 12 principles and received almost perfect scores by all my principals, except my last one…I was now 59. The last principal had given me almost perfect scores a couple years earlier when he was the assistant principal. The first year under his “leadership”, I received the lowest score of my career. The reason, I was not teaching the district required curriculum. I had already tried to show our new curriculum specialist the flaws in this curriculum, however she was getting her Ph.D. with our new curriculum as her focus. She disagreed with my suggestions, although I had been writing college curriculum for pre-teachers still working to get their degrees for several years. (I was even asked later to help solve some of the problems encountered with the curriculum by the manufacturers). The second year I was transferred to teaching history, even though they had to fill two math and one science position, but this was the only subject that I had no experience with. My very first evaluation in this field stated that I “did not know the subject”. (My lesson was awesome in my opinion, but the students were required to write in their journals and have essay questions on their tests, which I graded fully.) This upset the principal because I had students that were not passing and I was told to make sure they passed. I pointed out if they did not pass something in, although I stayed in at lunch, before and after school, called their parents, I could not give them a passing grade. Out of approximately 160+ students, I had a few students fail. (Not acceptable). By my third year, I had my assistant principal following me around with a clipboard in her hands. I asked why and her reply was that if she found me doing something wrong she could correct me. In the evaluation that finally decided that there was nothing I could do to improve my situation was the day my assistant teacher came into my last period of the day with 33 sixth graders. I love teaching and my enthusiasm carries over to my classes. My room was tiny, so much so that there was too little room to circulate through the desks to help students individually. We were watching a video clip and I was teaching them how to take Cornell Notes, I was the only 6th grade history teacher doing this, the others had told me it was too soon to teach 6 th graders how to take notes. Back to the subject, not all of my students could see my whiteboard because it was too low and the students in the back could not see over the heads of the students in front of them. I allowed those student who could not see to come and sit in the front and take notes. I even provided clipboards to help them. My evaluation wrote that she noticed that although all students seemed active and on task (remember this is the last period of the day and these are 6th graders), I did not know if they we’re taking the correct notes. She further stated in my evaluation that I should not allow students out of their seats and that I should find a way to make sure that all of my students could see the board while seated. When I asked how I could do this with 33 students in a class designed for 24, she did not have a suggestion, but told me to do it anyways. Another evaluation in which a student was giving a report on a dictator, which was extremely factual, I was cited for allowing the student at the end of his presentation in his summerization of the dictators rule by stating he was an evil man. My vice-principle told me that I should not allow negative statements to be made…..I had not taught about Hitler yet. This years final evaluation was so low that I came close to “Needing Improvement”. By now my health was getting so bad from the stress that my doctor, and by now I was seeing a psychiatrist, both advised me to retire. I was now 61. I was replaced with a teacher fresh out of school. There is only one senior teacher left at this school and she has been transferred to teaching the students that need an alternative setting, although she has a science degree. I worry about the future of education when school districts eliminate teachers that are highly trained and replace them with teachers that have little to no experience. Yes, enthusiasm is wonderful to have in a new teacher, however without the knowledge and experience that comes from being in a classroom, often this enthusiasm takes the wrong direction or misses some of the fundamental conceptual developments that only an experienced teacher would know. Sorry this is so long but teaching was my passion and I was good at it. And there is nothing that is being done to correct this problem other then to vent.
I’m so sorry this happened to you! I was a high school library media specialist for 23 years. At my current school I have to teach 5th & 6th grade English classes part time as well. I did receive training to teach high school English as an undergrad but that was back in the 80s! One way they “get” you is by throwing you into an area you really aren’t qualified to teach. Then they pick apart everything you do to make sure you fail. I fell to ‘needs improvement” for the first time ever in my career last year – mainly because the principal hates me. So far I’m still hanging in there. The same thing happened to my father when he was in his late 50s. He was pushed into a position where he was told he could either quit or they’d fire him. He quit and 2 years later died of colon cancer. This is such a terrible thing to do to people who have dedicated their lives to our students and such an incredible waste. I’m sorry for both the kids and for you.
I feel for you, and how your teaching career ended. I too was a teacher, and I am continuing my education. It is strange how so many people in other professions are older, yet they continue to work w/o the same ageist attitudes forcing them out. Administrators who have never taught are the worst evaluators. I think it should be mandatory for all administrators to student teach, at the least, prior to becoming an administrator. I hope you can find a niche where you can use your teaching talents.
I am a veteran teacher of 20 plus years, full of energy, and an enthusiastic teacher. Due to a divorce, I had to relocate and now after 4 years am still a substitute teacher.. I graduated Summa Cum Laude with my BS degree and had a 4.0 in graduate school. I’m certified to teach elementary ed., special ed through 9th grade, and K-12 ESL. The school district where I sub loves me and I am personally requested all the time by teachers. However, no one will hire me. I’ve been on a few interviews, but never hired. The last promising interview I had (with an inner city charter school), I was put with the very worst behaved Special Ed students they had, in a small room, with no information about the students or their behavioral issues. My lesson went fine, however one girl started verbally picking on another student. Before allowing me to intervene, the principal stood up (in the middle of my lesson) and told the students to “knock if off!” I was later told, by the recruiter, that the principal didn’t think I had the necessary disciplinary tools for the job. I was totally devastated. I am still applying for jobs, but am trying to accept the fact that at age 56 I will be subbing for the rest of my career and will not be hired to be a classroom teacher. I can’t imagine doing anything else, so will continue subbing as at least I am teaching. This situation has completely demoralized me, put me into a deep depression, and I’m not sure how I am going to make it financially. Any words of wisdom and encouragement would be appreciated!
Nowhere is this more true than in Indiana! Everyone here talks about how we can attract new teachers to fill shortages but no one addresses the reasons for the shortages. Older teachers are routinely pushed out to save money. I saw it happen 30 years ago with my father. Now it’s happening to me. When I was RIFed 7 years ago (after 23 years) I was only making $54,000. Still I had to start over at my next school at beginning teacher pay (although they did give me credit for my Master’s) so at 54 years old I had to take a pay cut of $15,000/year. As a result of administrator turnover I now find myself working for a principal who REALLY doesn’t appreciate my outspokenness or respect my years of experience. So I’ve learned to keep my head down and hope he won’t fire me before I can afford to retire. I use to think that the main motivating factor for this tendency to push out older teachers was strictly based on salaries but I realize now that there’s more to it than that. I thin there are many young administrators out there that just feel threatened by older, more experienced teachers and want them out. It is a such a shame because as this article states we have so much more to give than many of these younger, temporary teachers.
Younger is cheaper,.
You really hit a nerve here, Nancy. THANKS for the thoughts!
This story is ridiculous. They push out the teachers for one reason only. Money, high salary. Just retire, you can get hired back right away at new teacher pay. It’s fact. They use all types of ploys to force them out. They cant come out and say, you make too much much, you’re fired. This is the normal with all the budget cuts. I know many teachers, and I mean “many” teachers that have gone thru this. Forced into retirement and then all of a sudden get rehired. Its common place.
I am glad came across your website and read this. I am glad I read the the comments as well. At 45 I was just about to complete the application process for a teacher credential program. But, I was dragging my feet, feeling doubtful about it. like that little feeling inside saying “don’t”. all the comments here confirmed it for me. thank you all, you saved me a big headache and a lot of money
I am sorry to hear that, Mark. Let me just say that you don’t need to teach in a public school. If you really want to teach there are other school environments.
Don’t.
Very interesting post!
I got into teaching “late” in my career. And by “late” I mean late 30’s early 40’s. I went back to school in 2008 to finish my undergad (was 36 at the time) and told myself I wanted to finish before I was 40. Which I did in 2011. The week after I completed my undergrad I immediately started my Masters in Education Curriculum & Instruction program while working a full time 40 hour a week job AND doing my student teaching all at the same time. Still kept an A in all my classes as well.
Got laid off due to automation in my job path in 2012 (just turned 40), but it was close enough to the start of a school year that all teaching positions were already filled, so I substituted for a year in my home district to make a lot of good contacts. Which I did. That summer I snuck into the high school I was at a lot, where I made a very good friend with the AP in charge of subs who told me they literally had a teacher quit less than 2 hours ago. So she walked me right to the principal who interviewed me on the spot, and hired me on the spot. I was ELATED!!!
First year teaching though, I was not given a mentor as promised by the principal. He later told me halfway through the year that I had great relationships build with my students and had incredible activities to accompany my lessons, but having gone right from corporate to teaching as I did, I knew nothing of teaching strategies. So he recommended a few seminars I might want to attend. I did….and 3 others he didn’t even tell me about.
Summer leading into my second year I was all about improving. Watched YouTube, TED Talks, read blogs, websites, connected on social media…whatever I could to learn what I needed to know about the best ways to get kids to learn. It paid off. I was nominated for Teacher of the Month three times, nominated for Best student-centered classroom in a school of 230 teachers and 3600 students, nominated as Most Improved teacher…and with my peers saying all these things about me, I thought it was a great sign that I was doing something right.
Then came the blindside shot.
Principal tells me he doesn’t think I have grown enough as a teacher and doesn’t want to renew me, followed by the words “But I haven’t read your evaluation, and I’m not going to.” This said in front of my on-campus teacher union rep as well! Every single person in the school was floored by his decision. MY evaluation was stunning. I was rated as a highly proficient teacher, with several marks of “Exceeds expectations” from an evaluator who says no one should ever get those marks because we are all capable of improving something.
My team was absolutely stunned. Especially the young teacher on my team, who was in her first year at that school (third overall in her career) who had an evaluation that had her, based on what SHOULD have happened, on the short list to be walked out the door. What actually happened was that I resigned to prevent a non-renewal from going on my record, and the younger teacher was not only renewed, but REWARDED by being given every section of the new Human Geography classes that were going to be taught there the next year. A class I lobbied for and successful got added to the curriculum.
At that point, I had just turned 43. She was 26…and pregnant. One of the other teachers overheard the principal say specifically he wanted to get as many of the older teachers out of the school because “he couldn’t mold us the way HE wanted us to be. That we would challenge him on his decisions.” If you mean refusing to make the lowest grade a 60 instead of a zero when a student does no work, or when we don’t agree with every single word that comes out of your mouth….then yes, you are going to get challenged.
I was one of 8 teachers not brought back the following year. All of us over 40.
Texas is also a “funny” state for teachers. The statues for beginning teachers favor the schools instead of the educators. The first 3 years one is considered “probationary” to the point that a principal can simply not like the color of your hair and non-renew you claiming “it’s in the best interest of the school,” and the teacher has ZERO recourse to fight it. No. One.
So I have been substitute teaching for the past 2 years now to try to get back in a classroom, especially since I have finished my Masters degree (May 2016). This past school year I was forced to work a $12/hour job on top of substituting, giving me a 7 day a week schedule all year just to survive as my wife got laid off last May from her college position and has yet to find something else on her end as well.
But now, at 45, I am STILL not being given a chance to show what I can bring to a classroom. Summer 2016…200+ applications out…not one single call. Summer 2017, 200+ applications out again, one interview 4 weeks ago that I was promised follow up on and have yet to hear a single thing back about. My fear now is that I am NOT going to be looked at regardless of my abilities, and that my career teaching, the one I worked long and hard to get into, was ended by an unethical and unprofessional dictator before I was given a chance to grow.
It’s just sad that age can officially be an unofficial way to not hire someone who could possibly be the best thing your school ever had if you just gave them a chance.
I am retired and felt brace going forward w/part-time and a newly earned Single Subject Credential. I feel apprehensive after reading this!
My comment should say brave, not brace. Sorry for the typo.
I am an older man (age 56). I wanted to return to school to major in education and biology. Age discrimination was a fear of mine, because I saw it happen to my mother. After reading all these comments, maybe I will change plans. Sad, because botany and earth science are my bliss.
I must ask, is age discrimination as rampant in private schools? At this point in my life, I would accept a lower salary just to do what I love. My dream job would be to teach in a community college. At my age, this will probably not happen. I could see teaching in a private school, however.
Joe:
This describes where I’m at to a tee. I “retired” from K-6 teaching due to many things described in the comments. I am too young, and quite frankly, financially not secure enough to completely retire. I have wondered the same thing about private schools. My next effort is to go on edjoin.com and see what private schools are out there hiring. Then, I would like to apply and see what happens. I too would love to teach at a junior college. I am only “qualified” to teach up to 12th grade, though. I would encourage you to try as well.
Sadly, my husband, a Louisiana School teacher, and LEA union rep was forced into early retirement. At age 58. Why? because he stood firmly against the common core. NEA back the decision to remove him.
No longer do we have a union that truly represents the teachers, only one that takes the money to pay for the executives salaries. BTW, the LEA is down to less than 10k members. NEA?LEA support of the common core drove away the members. – andy my husband.
He can’t return to the classroom because in this state is against the law. so now this man with a PhD is working at Krogers…………
I have had a long career as a teacher/counselor/coach in education. I taught for 38 years in the classroom and then became a counselor at a school. After 6 years in that position I wanted to go back to the classroom. At 67 I obtained a full time teaching job in my subject field. The new school also wants me to coach. This is at a top rated hs in the metro area. I guess I feel blessed after reading some of the situations others are in.
Wow. This is a great piece. I’d also mention that in FL, there are districts that use subs forever because they can. Next, administrators love to fall back on the nebulous “class management skills” pretext for discriminatory action. And if you sue, you won’t ever work again. Then, you have the disconnect between education majors and career changers. Even though the FL legislature recognized the contributions that career changers (usually over 40) can bring to the classroom, so many admin peeps and tenured teachers don’t appreciate what you can offer. Good luck if you are smart and express yourself too…
Are school counselors treated similarly to teachers as they get older?
In my experience as a building representative and advocate for staff members, female counselors over the age of 50 have been targeted for harassment and dismissal. It’s very similar to what happens with teachers.
What can we do about this?
Injustice!
class action lawsuit.
Respectfully, I disagree because victims will not come forward. This website is the first like it. But the problem of age discrim in employment persists.
I’m not totally sure but I do believe it is possible to be anonymous in a class action lawsuit
https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/are-all-plantifts-in-a-class-action-lawsuit-public-1422859.html
Another avenue to change is to interest an academic or non-profit law organization to do research on hiring practices and patterns. THEN file a lawsuit.
Really should be study on how many new teacher hires with little education experience age 45 plus (second careers) compared to age range 22-45 kind of thing.
That’s the prima facie case! But it’d be great to get state agencies, news media, colleges, universities, as well as other entities that may come to mind, to investigate. We are living longer, 50 is the new 30. (Wink wink)…Attention brought to this issue may inspire admin peeps to spread the jobs out to a wider age span.
Wow, I’m 50, second career, and just finished Master’s Education with credential USC 4.0 GPA/honors, and so wish I had stumbled upon this BEFORE I endured over 2 years of demanding coursework, $$,$$$, half a year student teaching full time, more of my personal $ spent on classroom supplies for my lessons, and the (yes, I agree with other posts) demoralizing interview process (which is far worse than the other business career that I worked in). I only found all these articles on ageism in education after applying for numerous job openings in California, interviewing, and getting the feeling that I’m just there to fill a HR quota, with no job offer. Young and cheap, and unfortunately more often than not, not very good. That was the same problem with my previous career. One interview with a private school principal – he stated much to his dismay that they lost several teachers that were in their 20’s and only there for a year, because they wanted to move on to what they called ‘a real career’. He said that the younger generation doesn’t see education as a career at all, but more like something to do for a year or two until they get a real job. So, yes, I agree with the posts encouraging older teachers to try private schools, but the pay is lower, and many of us want the public school districts that offer secure pay increases and retirement benefits. Although I’m new to the field, I do have corporate experience, and it seems that education has become tremendously corporate like and is suffering because of this. I believe the one comment that districts seem to be okay with the revolving door of young teachers who only stay 1-5 years max, to keep costs down and avoid the skyrocketing retirement pension costs that we are now experiencing, that may jeopardize the six figure administrative salaries. Corporate heads also don’t like workers under them who are older and more experienced. I’ve witnessed new head of school in early 40’s, private school, get rid of all teachers older, and bring in young, recent college grads, who can view the head as being wise and all knowing Education Guru, despite the contrary being true, and be forever grateful for their first job and never challenge anything the head does or says. It seems like there are more and more super young, smart ones in their 30’s, pursuing administrative certification with higher salaries instead of teaching, and therefore, the hiring of younger teachers will continue. There are probably thousands of older teacher candidates, highly qualified (and highly annoyed at not securing employment) shaking their head whenever they read daily news accounts about the teacher shortage. I’ve also witnessed public classrooms where students are spending 50% of their class time online with district mandated learning platforms, so who needs qualified, experienced older teachers that cost more initially or in the long run, when we can run education in a more cost effective manner with cheaper labor? Very frustrating and scary for future generations!
Congrats on your advanced degree and awesome GPA. Sorry for your frustration at the injustice of age discrimination. I can relate, and it sucks.
I used to be in legal and I’ve never seen anything like trying to get a teaching job as a “mature” person and beating the proverbial dead horse to get hired in a decent district in SW Fl (think Peter Graves, Robert Vaughn, and the original Mission Impossible theme song)… Ironically, FL purports to be crying for teachers. When you are over 40, there is also a sex discrimination thing happening too, especially if you want to teach secondary social studies and are not an athletic coach!!!
Maybe the fact of your knowing reality is scary to some admin peeps and teachers?
You have a lot to offer the students from your experience. Never give up!
Thanks for sharing with the misery, lol! I totally believe what you say about secondary and coaching preferential treatment. In regards to people complaining about being negative……I”m so POSITIVELY thrilled that I stumbled upon this site. I’ve been going on interviews, started to slowly suspect that my age may be a factor, did Internet search, and found this and other posts on education ageism. I’m not trying to be negative or look for excuses, but these posts have helped me in a positive manner. I do think education programs need to discuss this, but then they would lose money. So much of this is about $, and not about the best interest of students.
A) There has never been a “teaching shortage”: its a lie to get a bunch of innocent victims to cough up a lot of money to take a boatload of classes to get a degree
B) The actual teacher surplus allows school admins to pick and choose who they will actually take.
C) The admins don’t give a rats rear end about about helping students learn, its all about THEIR power and fat paychecks. So they pick the teachers they can most easily control, even if they’re dumb as a bag full of hammers and barely passed their classes
D) If you’re any good, and they’re desperate enough, they still might hire you. But they won’t keep you if they can help it.
E) Especially as you get older and wiser and less likely to fall for their lies
F) Even if you take all the classes everyone says teachers should take to “stay current”
Bottom line: your students can worship the ground you walk on, and they might learn incredible things from you, but neither they nor their parents have any say in what happens. Those decisions are left in the hands of people who have spent as little time as possible actually teaching children anything at all They want to be able to say that they’re “in education”, but they suck out loud at working with students of any age, and they know it
Spot on on ever point.
Wow, this blog just never ends… This fact speaks proverbial volumes! I hope and wish so badly that DOE, DOJ, state agencies, and others would see and be encouraged to use this data and the instant ongoing narrative to encourage and support civil rights enforcement in education employment. Age discrimination is alive and wellin education, and also very very very hard to assert a prima facie case and prove. Once you’d get demographics on hires and fires, it’d be easy to establish snd get past the extant pretextual b.s. But, you don’t even get there because if you do this, you risk never working again and survival matters. Hang in everyone! Thanks for sharing! Keep trying and thinking of ways to make this scenario better for each other and future teachers.
Thank you.
I am also convinced by now that there has never been a “teacher shortage”. It’s always been a lie to get tons of college paying students, tons of applicants for every teaching vacancy that pops up (as an insurance to fill them all easily), hire mostly young college graduates for the most minimum teaching wage and prefering them also because they will put up with any crap and believe their admins. I also believe the suspicion of a massive effort to avoid pensions (I was kept short of getting even the most minimum one of $200/month). And, at least since the No Child Left Behind Act, a massive turnover is also generated so that principals (and vice principals) can use the thrown out teachers as scapegoats for rising student drop-outs, not rising state test grades, or even shrinking student grades. This goes beyond mere age discrimination since also most young people entering this profession soon drop out of it, too, with or against their will.
And to empower this evil system even more, the hiring of teachers is made dependent on teacher certificates which expire after 5-6 years. The renewal and/or reinstatement of one’s certificate demand that one has come up with further regionally accredited college credits (at least 6 semester hours) or more affordable (even cost free) continued education offered by one’s school district. But, guess what! When you constantly don’t get your teacher contract renewed or for properly fitting jobs must get yourself hired in always new school districts (yes, job searching every year, relocating every summer) those credits you spent your time and efforts on disappear in a vacuum. I was never given any transcripts or certificates for them. I doubt anything was sent to the state’s education department. So, now that I was trying to get rehired as a public school teacher anywhere, I don’t even have the proof of those stupid credits to bring my certificate back.
Yep, fresh college graduates wet behind the ears can get the teaching jobs that a widely experienced and high quality teacher like me cannot get (a native speaker of the language I taught and a former researcher with a master’s degree in the main science subject I taught, and great teaching outcomes for my students). The school district will get the freshly graduated new teacher the state certificate. But a high quality teacher with years of experience just gets told to get a valid certificate again somehow by him- or herself. For what? To re-enter this musical chairs game or never get hired again at all any more?
Professional experience counts for nothing in this profession, making it one of the most precarious professions. I love teaching and helping young folks get started well in their coming adult life. Having lots of life experience, I can do a lot more for them than merely teach the subjects. But not a chance. I am stuck in poverty and must look for other potential jobs where age discrimination is also rampant. That is the wonderful society we live in.
Didi, you raise some critical points and present your concerns well. Avoiding pensions. Keeping teachers on a nonstop certificate loop. Creating massive turnover. Thank you for sharing. You’ve given us lots to think about.
You hit the nail on the head!
Well, I see the let’s get positive at the same time as realizing how valuable this comment post is for venting and sharing, Kudos to Ms.Bailey! The continued discussion shows what a good article you wrote and that is pretty cool…
Now, can people write to editors of news media and state agencies and AARP and everywhere to let people know the truth and maybe that will have a positive result? Also contacting legislators about the problem. And getting the “groundswell” to devise solutions?
What do you think?
Great idea! I’m tired of petitions. I’ve signed so many, but this does sound petition worthy. Maybe some kind of letter signed by many, or many letters to the very people you mentioned here. Thank you!
My wife was laid off during “The Great Purge” around 2010 when for several years in a row 10% of teachers were laid off because there wasn’t enough money to pay for them anymore. But who’s going to hire a step 10 teacher with Masters + 30? The answer is no one. It is easier to get a first year no experience teacher past the school board because they are cheaper.
Accidental omissions, such as forgetting to include all of the transcripts or to neglect to include ALL of the teaching experience on the resume gets an interview, sometimes a call back 2nd level. But Years of service and education levels are stored in the state’s central database so there is no hiding your experience or education… Imagine that. Education, the only field where it is advantageous to NOT have experience or education.
You are so right. I moved to Texas at age 50. It took me three years and applying at a small rural district 50 miles from my home to find a position. I will never get a job in the metroplex. I’ve said for years that ageism is alive and well. Texas screwed me over for Social security as well so I just hope I can make it to the rule of 90 to retire (age and years of service). And btw, they only count my years teaching in Texas. I’ll have to be 77 and continuously working to get any retirement. I just hope my school will keep me that long. ????
I’m sorry to say this but one could see from the school admin point of view they are required to find the most cost effective way to spread the limited funds to get the job done. If the union had negotiated that the youngest teachers should get the most money it seems the school admin would be working hard to get rid of them instead. So it’s not really your age they are against – it’s the high cost the union has attached to you. Perhaps if pay was merit based older, and therefore better, teachers would automatically get paid more and hired more often. It’s time to realize who is really to blame.
(I’m a 50+ business veteran that appreciates the value of experience and would love to get out of the rat race and teach kids – so I get your frustrations – but I can’t really blame the school admins – they have a business to run – it’s your cost not your age they are against.)
Schools are not a business. But there is some truth to what you say, that the higher the pay step a teacher goes the less chance they have of being hired. But there is also the argument that teachers gain experience and do better as they climb that ladder. I would also say that the union looks out for teachers. States with a strong teachers union have always had some of the best schools. You should blame those who don’t want to pay for good teachers. Merit programs have never worked and have always been unfair.
NANCY: looks like you hit a nerve with this one! 🙂
My response to your observation that “We often seem to be unfairly perceived as unmalleable ” makes me remember just how often, once NCLB and R2T were forced into our schools, I heard myself (and apparently all older experienced teachers) referred to by those forcing reform as OLD DOGS: as in “you can’t teach old dogs new tricks…”
Thank you, Ciedie. It isn’t fair, but it also isn’t about that, I don’t think. It is about not paying teachers the higher steps and destroying the teaching profession altogether. And that’s from this “old dog!” ( :
Texas is infamous for age discrimination in education. Many districts think that kids fresh out of college with zero life or work experience is a better investment than those of us who have either been teaching for years, or have a wealth of life experience to bring to a classroom.
I got into teaching right when I turned 39 after spending over 20 years in corporate positions where I was always in a teaching/training/mentoring role. My first year as a teacher was a growing year, learning strategies and such. My second year I was nominated as one of the most improved teachers on a campus of over 200 teachers, nominated as having one of the most student centered and student focused classrooms, and as teacher of the month 3 times, and my evaluation that year was done by an evaluator that said no one deserved marks of “Exceeds Expectations” because we all will have ways to grow….yet gave me 7 marks of Exceeds Expectations. Regardless of that, my principal said he felt I hadn’t grown enough and didn’t want to renew me, followed immediately by the admission that he hadn’t read my review and WASN’T GOING TO!
Texas is one of the worst states to try to get a start teaching in. The laws are totally AGAINST new teachers. for the first few years in any district you are a probationary teacher, but in those same years all a principal has to do is say “it’s not in the best interest of the students for you to come back” while having ZERO basis for that decision. A principal could not like the color of your hair and not renew you….literally. It can be used against teachers in so many ways, and has. The year my principal pushed me out, he was overheard saying that he wanted to get rid of teachers he didn’t think he could mold the way he wanted, and that he though anyone over 40 should go because they “weren’t as effective as new teachers.”
So here I am, 4 years after being pushed out of my classroom by an immoral, unprofessional, and unethical principal I still have not found a classroom. I have substituted every day for the past 4 years in over 9 different districts. Even though I make an incredible name and reputation for myself wherever I go, it means nothing come spring hiring time because I always find out the teachers who got the same position I applied for was simply younger. I’ve gone from working in a profession I worked hard to get into and making a good salary with nothing to worry about, to now working for $12 an hour at an Amazon warehouse where my Masters in Education is wasted.
I would love to challenge the system and make them show my their ever loved “research and data” showing how younger teachers are more viable and how veteran or experienced teachers can ever be considered a liability.
I’m sorry, Todd. It looks like you’re not alone. I hope something turns up. I’d try private schools. The pay might not be good, but it’s a job. And sometimes the conditions are good.
I’m not so much concerned about the salary. I simply want stability in my career. My wife and I don’t have a need for high salary positions as we are fairly humble in our lives. We have almost everything we need with only a few wants. Of course the major want (and need) is just to get out of the debt caused by the loss of both incomes at the same time.
I’m starting to wonder if maybe I can take what I now know about education and do a whole stand up comedy show about it….after all, a lot of what is going on in education these days IS laughable. 🙂
That’s rough. I hope things turn around. I’d try private schools.
I am not a lawyer but as I understand it a ruling by the U.S. Seventh Circuit Court of Appeals based in Chicago makes it now legal to discriminate by age, The Age Discrimination in Employment Act only protects current workers and not those seeking a job. So if you are trying to get into public education or return to education after the age of 40… good luck!
Wow! Thank you! I think this is it. Incredible. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/23/reuters-america-age-bias-law-does-not-cover-job-applicants-u-s-appeals-court.html
Thank you for publishing this. My last few years of teaching in Indiana felt very much like I was being bullied by administrators. On my last evaluation before retirement, I was marked down for writing a special education goal that the students would demonstrate the stated skill on 4 of 5 trials. The administrator wrote that I should have said 80% of trials. This marked me down on my evaluation. Just a parting reminder of why I retired when I did. I dearly miss the students and families.
I understand. You’re certainly not alone. There’s a new realization, at least, about the reasons behind all this. Thank you for posting, Judy. Thank you for sharing. Stay in touch.
Negative? Maybe, but realistically, venting to other educators in this situation is therapeutic for me. I was targeted by my 12 year old principal the past two years. He picked me apart piece by piece and left me doubting myself as a teacher.
I’m in my 27th year of teaching and my district is TOXIC. I’d LOVE to get out, but no one will hire a teacher at the top of the pay scale. The almighty dollar always wins out. I could write a novel about the last two years of hell. I feel like I’m on the verge of a breakdown at times because I’m criticized for things I never in a million years saw coming.
Most recently, I thought of hiring a lawyer, but it’s so expensive. Who can we speak to? Administrators are devious in finding ways to get away with scrutinizing particular teachers and it makes me sick to witness such heartless acts towards people who don’t deserve it. I’ve devoted my life to teaching and I feel like I was put on earth to teach…. and now, 27 years into my career, I’m walking on eggshells… get to work at 7:30, stay until 6… get home and try to spend quality time with my own children… then back to my schoolwork for hours… I couldn’t work harder if I tried. Yet, my principal worships the ground the newer teachers walk on – and many are mediocre at best…. get in at 8:30, leave right after buses, do a half ass job on everything, volunteer for nothing… but they’re cheaper, so let’s bow down… I know I’m ranting, but I never in a million years thought that one person could continuously shred me down so immensely… any advice or help would be helpful.
And if you are going to tear me apart on my “negativity”, don’t bother responding. I want teachers to respond that have experienced this hell I am in.
Annie, I’m sorry for you in this awful situation. Rant away. It looks like you’re not alone. I am so saddened to see teachers leaving the profession. There’s no excuse for them to be treated badly. Please keep us posted. I hope things start to look up for you.
You are absolutely correct! Age Discrimination is alive and well. The schools will allow you to “SUB” but they see us as OLD.
Trump will be 74 on June 14th and yes all the politicians are are older and eill hang on until they are dragged out. . .
I went on FMLA for a respiratory illness in February. Highly effective- recognized at a national conference. My administrator gossiped about my FMLA to colleagues, demanded that I submit work during FMLA, then demanded more work or it would reflect negatively on my evaluation. I didn’t give her the opportunity. I retired in the spot. My evaluation is a legal document and to retaliate against me for being on FMLA by holding my evaluation hostage was the last straw.
At least maybe I can go to another district if my lung capacity ever improves.
That’s insensitive. I’m sorry, Jennifer. You deserved kinder treatment. Feel better soon.
After reading so many comments, I believe age discrimination should be put through legislation. I believe their are a lot perks to keep people working in the 50 and over age group. Ageism happens everywhere in public and private sectors. I recently became a teacher at age 45. I am let go every year. So its heartbreaking and not fair, especially when you work so hard to get your credential.
Thanks for your comment. I’m sorry you’re let go every year.
Thank you to everyone who has posted their stories on this site. I found this article in my desperate search for understanding. Not knowing where or who to turn to for some insight into what I was experiencing, I typed, “How are aging teachers treated in your school district?” I needed to see if I was really as alone as I felt. I’m sorry discrimination against older teachers is so prevalent and worse tolerated across the country. Although I am relieved to find, I am not alone in being unreasonably and relentlessly discriminated against, I’m sad to think other caring teachers must bear the pain of this bias as well.
Include me, Sally. While I like writing and connecting with others, I miss teaching and left my field much too early. I’m sorry you’re having a hard time. Don’t give up. I’m hoping after Covid-19 they will need to hire teachers. Let your district know you’re available if you’re still interested in teaching. Keep us posted.
I had this same thing happen to me. I decided to go into teaching when I was about 35. Went back to school in 2008 to finish the Undergrad degree barely I started and stopped many years before and finished it completely by 2011, and 2 weeks after that I jumped directly into my Master’s program for Education Curriculum & Instruction because I knew I wanted to either go into higher education, or help develop assessment tests for students that actually worked and weren’t standardized/high stakes exams. At that point I was working a 40 hour a week job at night, doing my 40+ hour student teaching semester during the day, and STILL taking 3-4 Masters level courses simultaneously each semester because I wanted it that bad.
By 2012 the job I had went through massive layoff and I was let go, which gave me the opportunity to substitute in several districts around me, including the district I graduated from myself, and in 2013 I managed to land a classroom in one of the schools I was subbing at because of my passion to be a positive influence for the kids and bring them the absolute best I had as a teacher. But by 2015 I had been nominated for Teacher of the month 3 times by my peers, voted as one of the most improved new teachers on campus, and as having the most student-centered classroom among all teachers…and I fell victim to the politics of the Texas educational system.
The very same principal who lauded my passion for teaching and hired me personally had turned on me. He shot down every nomination for anything I was up for because he didn’t agree with my peers (not that I wanted the accolades or anything, but these were PEER nominations that he never once before shot down), but then unethically pushed me out of the school along with 20 other teachers because we were, as was heard by many other people on staff, “too old to mold the way he wanted us to be.” He literally told me in front of our on-campus teacher union rep “I don’t feel you have grown enough as a teacher to warrant bringing back next year”, followed immediately by the words “and I have your evaluation for this year right here, but I’m not going to read it.” I had one of the highest evaluations of ANY teacher on campus that year…period. And he had never once set foot in my classroom for the past two years, but still had the gall and audacity to tell me he didn’t think I had grown as an educator despite my peers telling him I was one of the most improved. But it didn’t matter, he wanted me out, and that ended up being the nail in my teaching career…a mere two years into it. And he got away with it because the deck is purposely stacked AGAINST new teachers in Texas to where within the first 3 years of a teachers career, a principal can literally make any reason up at all to not renew you and a teacher has ZERO recourse, we can’t fight it at all. Literally, they could says “I don’t like the color of your shoes” and it would be a valid reason to not renew a teacher. He knew this, used it against me, and won…and then proceeded to twist the knife in my back and lie to other principals about me. Despite showing my evaluation to the few schools that gave me an interview in the months after my forced resignation from my school, including one that was about to hire me, they listened to his lies when he told them I was a bad teacher, I didn’t take direction well, and had physically injured a student while in the classroom…all of which were proven and verifiable lies. But they still didn’t give me a chance, and I still had no recourse against him despite what he had done. He got rewarded with a promotion, and eventually became one of the heads for staff recruitment in a more prominent district.
I tried substituting again in many districts around me while applying to get into those districts, but was never once granted an interview, even in the schools where the principals knew me and my good reputation within the school. I finished my Masters in 2016 despite not having a classroom, but even that made no difference. I was over 40 at that point, and nothing I was doing was getting me anywhere. Then in 2019 I went to a job fair for a district that had numerous schools fighting to get me to sub for them, but when I went to talk to the principal of one of the schools and she asked me why I was even there to begin with, I told her “Because I really want to teach in your school. I’ve been subbing here for 2 years now and I love the staff and the kids.” Her reply was not only shocking, but she said it out loud for everyone around her to hear clearly. “You won’t ever get a classroom again because you’re on the wrong side of 40.”
The line for people to talk to her about her school vanished immediately. But like a prophecy…she was right. I was never given an interview or considered for an interview by any district. School administrators constantly felt that someone fresh from college with zero experience at all is a better option than someone with a lifetime of experience in the world and actual teaching experience….in other words “they are cheaper to hire.” I struggled to find a job and ended up working for Amazon for almost 3 years. I went from making $55k a year to $12/hour, had my soul crushed, my dreams destroyed, my body physically and permanently injured multiple times and my attitude and personality went from always being happy and outgoing to a near constant state of anger and negativity, then COVID lock-downs hit and I was out of work completely for all of 2020. I became quite legendary on Linkedin as I had chronicled my journey extensively. In the year of COVID, I had put out over 1400 documented applications for roles I Was suited for in education, learning & development, or training of any kind…and had only gotten am actual interview (not a just a screening call) 10 times for all my work. 10 interviews for countless hours applying and modifying resumes to fit a job description. I had been out of work for 351 days and without any income whatsoever aside from my meager unemployment benefits which barely paid the bills before I was finally hired by a financial company in March 2021.
So I got out of education entirely. Not by choice, because I absolutely LOVED being in the classroom. I spent years preparing for my life as a teacher, only to have it taken away by an unethical, immoral, and unprofessional administrator and an uncaring and unforgiving educational system. But at least now I have a position with a company that gives me absolute freedom to do my work, has much better medical benefits, and I can work from home. But at the end of the day, if everything in the world was “normal”…
I’d still rather have my classroom back.
I’m sorry, Todd. This is such a sad story and her announcing you’re the wrong side of 40 sounds like a lawsuit to me, but that’s so difficult to do not to mention costly. Are there any other teachers who you could connect with? This is infuriating especially at this time when teachers are needed.
Thank you for sharing. I know you spent a lot of time writing this. I will try to revive this post for you and Dena. It was written a few years ago but this is timely information. I hope it’s O.K. that I mention your comment.
Feel free to mention away. 🙂 I know I originally posted a few years ago, but some of the posts I have seen recently made me want to post something of a more comprehensive update to everything. lol
And yes, it could have been a lawsuit which I would have absolutely won and been labeled as a troublemaker and NEVER been looked at as a teacher candidate….but I opted simply for reporting her to the school board and let the chips fall where they may. She was INCREDIBLY not liked at all in the district, not just among parents and teachers, but even among other principals. So when she said that at a job fair full of her peers, she was 100% done. They gave her the option to retire early on her own since she was at that point in her career anyway, or be removed.
Amazingly….she fought it. And lost. And I smiled.
Not just because of what she said to me, but for the school she “led” because her successor was LEAGUES better than her and took that particular school from one of the worst to one of the top middle schools in the district in less than 2 years because she values all her teachers and made the students and parents feel welcomed there! The previous “vibe” was more of a jail or prison everyone was serving time in, and everyone was under suspicion and not welcomed or wanted there at all.
It addresses the concerns and experiences of older teachers who face challenges in the hiring process and are often overlooked in favor of younger educators. The post highlights the need for fair and inclusive hiring practices that value experience and expertise regardless of age. By raising awareness about this issue, the blog post contributes to the ongoing conversation about teacher shortages and the importance of equitable employment opportunities in education.
Thank you, David! Appreciated.
I too am in the position of being a “new’ teacher at age 72 here in Arizona. I was gullible in believing there was a “teacher shortage crisis” I too applied to over 300 teaching “openings” 3 interviews two of which reminded me that “Iwas way on the other side of 40” I took my BA secondary Ed degree in 2023 was “jokingly” made the “dean” of my graduating class. out of 700 plus teacher graduates I along with 5 other “non-traditional” students in ages from 41 to my age of 71 have not been able to obtain teaching positions for the same reason: “well beyond age 40” Don’t mess with a “retired” person who is in great physical health and stamina, and who is determined. I am seriously exploring and working on establishing grounds to initiate a class action lawsuit here in Az and at the stage I have no qualms of being named as the lead Plaintiff.
Wow! Michael! Good for you although I’m sorry you have to do that. Are you working with the others? Sometimes there’s power in numbers, as you likely know. Please let us know how it goes. Good luck! And thank you for sharing. Maybe you’ll inspire others.
Since my last comment in 2017 much has happened in regards to education. Much has come to light especially in California.
Back in 2017 I had considered applying for a teaching credential program, but a nagging feeling kept saying ‘don’t do it”.
I had substituted and taught ESL prior to that, I stepped away from it in 2010 because of high blood pressure, stress and anxiety that I experienced from fellow teachers and admin. I wanted to believe it was an isolated incident,
But, more research and what has come to light since 2017 has shown that it is not isolated.
I firmly believe that the education system needs a serious overhaul and many people in education need to be removed because they are not truly educators.
I really love your page Nancy.
Thank you, Mark. I think we need to evaluate how universities are working and also the nonprofits that churn out teachers so rapidly. I’m sorry you ran into that problem.
It’s just sad that the principles and policies created 20+ years to combat ageism and keep older workers from being pushed OUT of career roles because of their age are now being used against older workers to KEEP them out of roles they are highly qualified for and forcing people to go on being unemployed for prolonged periods of time….
And the school districts, businesses, and corporations just. don’t. care. At least not Stateside.
When I was forced out of my classroom by an unethical and unprofessional principal who wanted to fill his school with young teachers and get rid of those he felt were “too old to mold the way he wanted them to be”, I got very few, if any, interviews….and I was only 43 at the time. All of my years teaching had garnered me some of the best evaluations in my subject, and on my campus in general…but it didn’t matter. I was “too old”, so they hid behind replies like “it was very competitive”, “you are overqualified”, “you have too much experience”….as if ANY of these were valid reasons to not hire me. I even lost out on a role to a girl who had JUST graduated from college, no experience at all, and I was told that “we don’t think you are qualified enough to take the role”….but a 20 year old is? I’ve been alive and working longer than she’s been alive….but no, she is more qualified? No….she was just younger.
I went to every teacher job fair in every district around me…over 15 districts, over 200 schools….and who did I see there? People my age or older, all of who had the same sullen, defeated look on their fact that they were in that position as well. Some in almost similar or identical situations to me. All being given the same lip service from those who were representing their schools…”you have great experience, and we would love to explore this with you”…..and then crickets after the fact.
So I did some experiments…..I applied overseas. The UK, UAE, Japan, Finland, other European nations that had quality educational systems….just to see what would happen.
ALL of them wanted me.
The UAE even went so far as to tell me how they viewed teachers…..they are REVERED there. Had I taken that role, I would have been given a house, a driver, a salary almost three times what my American salary was, paid flights home to see family on holidays, free medical care….and not ONE mention of my age, only my experience.
Sadly, America has gone from “the best person for the job gets the job” to “the youngest and cheapest person gets the job, but only keeps it as long as they remain the cheaper option”
Thank you, Todd. How interesting that other countries valued you and appear to lift teachers. However, that might be changing in the UK. Worth watching.
When I started looking initially, it was in the UK as I loved it when I visited there many years ago….I even went so far as to be proactive and have my teaching credentials here transferred and confirmed to “QTS” status in their system….and then changed my focus to teaching in Scotland, because….well….Scotland.
Ultimately…I never returned to a classroom anywhere. I now work for a company that contracts directly with the Dept. of Defense where I am given EVERY bit of support needed to help develop training and curriculum for programs and other departments within the defense atmosphere.
Thanks, Todd. I’m sorry for the students who missed out, but happy you are treated with the respect that you deserve on your job. Take care.
I thought that I was living in an area that practiced age discrimination as well. This confirms my feelings. I went back to college and graduated at age 39. I had a GPA of 3..67 and graduated Magna Cum Laude after 4 years of working 3 part-time jobs and raising 3 children as a single mother. Time after time, I would apply for jobs only to be rejected. My high school teacher who was assist. principal when I was job seeking told me that at my age, I would cost a school district money because I would be someone who would stay at the job, get my master’s and retire, whereas younger teachers might not stay in the profession and the districts could keep rehiring young teachers at base salary. This left a bitter taste in my mouth regarding our education system. I also lost a job to a man who was asst football coach. He had no honors at all when he graduated and his language skills were extremely low–pretty awesome as an English teacher–would you say?!
I did spend some years doing long-term subbing and also teaching at a business school where I didn’t need a master’s. It is so sad that our world has come to what it is today. Someone my age now (63) has so much life experience and knowledge to share with student,. Life sucks and then you die…
It’s true that age discrimination exists in this field, but this site is soooo negative. I am taking myself off of it.
I would agree that this thread has become something of a venting ground for those impacted by this situation. I myself vented in a reply almost a year ago. However, I think that the intensity of the reactions speaks to the absence of any real forum that people in our situation can engage in and use as a vehicle for support–and as a way to make our voices heard. We are apparently many–so why does it seem like we are an invisible population?
Perhaps some more positive and productive discourse can come out of this.
I follow this blog post despite having come to the realization that I will NEVER be able to get a job teaching let alone a serious interview.
The person who complained that it was “sooo negative” is probably someone who isn’t facing age discrimination… yet.
Sharing our experiences no matter how negative is the first step to creating positive change. If we can’t talk about reality then how can we change things?
Actually I am retired. My soooo negative remark that I made is after retirement, and after age discrimination believe it or not. I just think that negative voices reign on this site, and yes I would not wish the political/ageist system on anyone.. There is truth to what people are saying on this site, but it gives me a sense of hopelessness, and is very discouraging. Sorry, that’s just how I feel.
Thank you for sharing, Francesca. I’m sorry I missed this. But as you can see, there are a lot of teachers still upset about age discrimination. I hope this finds you well. Best wishes.
I actually understand, Brett. I sometimes get tired of writing negative posts!
But I do hope by sharing it might help some teacher know they aren’t alone. And maybe someone will switch on a light bulb for them by sharing circumstances.
There are a lot of rotten things happening to public schools, teachers, parents and especially students. I’m always on the look out for ways to turn it around, but sometimes you have to expose the truth too.
Thanks for your comments. I will try harder to search for that silver lining.